Thread: My current limitations

My CTSW is tied down 40 miles away because I wasn't willing to land today with the winds 90 degrees cross 17 kts gusting to 30 kts.

I've landed at this field many times in such conditions but not yet in the CTSW. My gut made the decision, I'm very cautious in this design after 60 hours.

I think I'll be at the Eastern Sierra Regional Airport at sunrise, as long as the winds die by then. I'll be more comfortable when my CT is in her hangar.

I had a sense that the winds would be cross, strong and gusty today so I planned only a short flight and some windy landing practice. The winds came up early and suddenly and I am a chicken, so I ended up blowing 1/2 the day and still have to go back to fly her home.

My sense is that the CTSW-06 is quite stable in calm or at least smooth conditions but requires a lot more input and judgement in winds beyond 20kts than other aircraft that I have flown.

It is almost always easy for me to round out and fly only 1 foot above the runway and then work on stalling as I contact. When winds are a factor I tend to regain unwanted altitude and use power as though I never really know when she might want to fly some more.

I sense that I have much yet to learn.

I don't think calling yourself "chicken" is the right term, I find "SMART" to be a much better one. Kind of goes along with "better safe then sorry" which is never a wrong decision.

Keep us informed and learning.

Roger H

I very much agree with you Roger - better to be a chicken that is alive then to be a dead goose.

The only problem I and others found with the old CTsw (2005 model) is that you can run out of elevator in windy conditions but I believe it is much better in the 2006 model

Originally Posted by administrator

I don't think calling yourself "chicken" is the right term, I find "SMART" to be a much better one. Kind of goes along with "better safe then sorry" which is never a wrong decision.

Keep us informed and learning.

I agree. The toughest part of being PIC, is setting your personal limits, and then making yourself adhere to them. Sometimes that doesn't make for a convenient outcome when you have to leave your plane somewhere else, but at least you are able to fly it home later.

Thanks for the posts CharlieTango. I'm learning alot through them.

Roger F

I don't know to much about this but I assume that the lighter the plane the "less well" it does as the winds get "crosser". While I really enjoy learning about the category of Light Sport Airplanes I sometimes wonder if this is where someone should start out...would they be better off learning in a 150 or 172 with a little more weight behind them? I don't know.

I do know that the best thing a pilot can learn is their own and their planes limitations and stick with them.

Roger H

Here's why I should have known better



Look at the lennies forming in a line above the hangar with the 3 windows. I knew there were winds aloft and I could see the direction would create a crosswind when and if it lowered to ground level.

These types of clouds are formed by winds that osculate as they hit the sierra crest so one potential would be for that wind to intermittently become the surface wind.

Here's how I got snookered, immediately after take off I hit super smooth air and great performance at 50% throttle. This CT is a pleasure to fly at lower throttle settings and still seems to get about 110kts. Anyway the scenery was great the air was perhaps the most perfectly smooth I had ever seen so I ventured away for about 1/2 hour and when I got back x-wind gusts where 30kts.

I found I didn't even want to fly the approach which would have been informative. I could have easily judged how limited I am by my rudder but I probably would have sensed a little window where things felt predictable and let it settle down. I guess my level of control or at least my level of confidence in this aircraft just isn't there yet.

I don't know to much about this but I assume that the lighter the plane the "less well" it does as the winds get "crosser". While I really enjoy learning about the category of Light Sport Airplanes I sometimes wonder if this is where someone should start out...would they be better off learning in a 150 or 172 with a little more weight behind them? I don't know.

I do know that the best thing a pilot can learn is their own and their planes limitations and stick with them.

Roger H

Roger, How much crosswind you can handle is NOT a function of weight but most of all a function of RUDDER and landing speed. If you can keep her straight all the way down to the ground and all the way down to touchdown speed, then the rudder is sufficient. If not, you'd land in a crab and your gear won't like that too much and even with a trycycle gear you can manage running off the runway. I land my CT in EVERY condition anybody dares to land a 152 or 172. My 2005 CTSW runs out of rudder at about 20 kts cross at -12 deg of flaps and at about 18 kts with 0 deg of flaps. That is with smooth crosswinds. If the winds are gusting (like they do many times in wave conditions due to the fact that the wave sometimes touches down and sometimes doesn't, as well as the obstacle induced turbulence associated with stronger winds in general), then take the higher of the two values (gusting 15 to 25 means take 25) and subtract your personal chicken factor and then decide if you go for it or if you land somehwere where conditions are better. Also, when the winds are gusty good aileron and elevator control helps to stay in control. The CT does excellent in all regards and having the option landing in different flap settings helps a lot as well. If you haven't landed in all flap settings then do so with your CFI on board first.
As for the personal limits - always listen to that gut feeling. It's there to keep you safe.

cheers

Ernst

Ernst,

My CFI said that I have a very good feel for the CT and that I should explore other flap setting landings on my own. To date they have all been 30 degrees.

I figure I will try 15 degrees next, then zero, then 40, then negative 6, does that seem like the right sequence?

I use 30 deg most of the times, 0 second most often(for the stronger crosswind days), 15 very rarely(basically if I need less flap for crosswinds then I use 0 and I have practiced that very, very often), -12 very rarely, 40 very rarely.

I find 40 the one needing most attention as the aircraft becomes very draggy and you NEED power to efficiently use it. I would almost say I can land shorter in 30 than in 40 simply because I have done that so often. -12 is for the landings in the violent winds and crosswinds when I shouldn;t have been out there in the first place

Be aware of the different angels of of runway view you have. Low and overs in different flap settings give a good intor into landings in different flap setting. Be aware that slow sped climb in -12(-6) doesn't work very well.

cheers


Ernst

I went right up to my limitations on Friday. I flew up to Norman, OK (OUN) to have lunch with some friends and escape an excessive number of small visiting children.

Winds were forecast from the south at 10G15. That is at the limit of what I want to fly at. However, it was almost right down runway 17 at OUN. Ok, I figure, time to give it a try.

When I got there, the winds were pretty active - 180@12G18. Ok, I figure, just a higher speed approach to 17. Except.... I had forgotten the NOTAM that 17 was closed for maintenance until 2200! I will have to land on 21.

Ok, I figure, that's a xwind component of 6kt G9. I should be able to handle it. First approach was going well. It was more gusty than steady, but the approach is good, speed is good. I almost get it flared out and a gust comes along and I balloon. I add power since I know the gust will abate, but I wind up bouncing firmly - not hard, but firmly. There is plenty of runway left, but I do not hesitate to put the power in and go around.

The next approach is better. The wind is thankfully less gusty and I get the airplane down. Quick flare, landing a bit fast, no back pressure to get steering authority on the nosewheel and dump the flaps, stick over to the left to avoid having the wing get picked up. Made it.

I get on the ramp and don't believe the wind measurement. The difference between the mean wind and gusts seems a lot more than 6 kt. Perhaps part of the problem is that I was downwind of a few hangars (on the ramp and when landing) and was feeling the effects of turbulence from the buildings (runway 13 at RBD is ALWAYS like that). I was also solo (150 lb), no baggage and 1/2 fuel - about 960 lb - the airplane was light and more susceptible to gusts.

Flight back to ADS was uneventful and despite ADS reporting 10G16 with a 20 deg crosswind, it felt nothing like what I experienced at OUN. Perhaps it's just being at one's home airport; who knows. Either way, I made a great landing.

Unfortunately, landings don't average out and in retrospect, I made a dumb call - I haven't made that many crosswind landings in the CT, certainly not in gusty conditions. Not connecting the wind conditions and the NOTAM for the closed runway was DUMB. However, the airplane and I made it Ok and I am (hopefully) smarter.

I will be paying more attention to the gust portion of the crosswind in the future.

Doug